tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10820485.post516460376412294220..comments2023-11-03T09:36:22.100-04:00Comments on In From the Cold: Return of the Speech Police?George Smileyhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/07049707648660651119noreply@blogger.comBlogger16125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10820485.post-60232748601529356632009-02-25T00:48:00.000-05:002009-02-25T00:48:00.000-05:00It looks like Former Spook has already taken care ...It looks like Former Spook has already taken care o things with a follow up post in which a certain 0-6does a CYA that is't going over too well. oh well.SMSgt Machttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08126690689798203866noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10820485.post-70269679918773949072009-02-23T17:14:00.000-05:002009-02-23T17:14:00.000-05:00Hey 'A'. How about reading the freakin' post and t...Hey 'A'. <BR/>How about reading the freakin' post and then the thread before getting your panties in a bunch? The only person we can confirm is engaged in political activity related to official capacity is the good Colonel himself. THAT is generally the freaking point of most of the comments. <BR/><BR/>As to your:<BR/>"Civilians are NOT free to express their opinions about politics if they express support for the success or failure of one party over the other. That is part of the Hatch Act." <BR/>You get a day or two to clarify your point before I use it as a 'BS' burial shroud for your late-irate driveby. <BR/><BR/>I would recommend you actually <I>read</I> the Hatch Act first. There IS a government website available to help you navigate the nuances if you can find it.SMSgt Machttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08126690689798203866noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10820485.post-64158934695238836612009-02-22T18:31:00.000-05:002009-02-22T18:31:00.000-05:00I have to raise the BS flag. I saw these same sort...I have to raise the BS flag. I saw these same sort of cautions about comments about G.W. Bush when he was CINC. I did, not however, hear from my comrades-in-arms the same level of vitriol about Bush as I heard about Clinton. The fact is, the current president is the CINC. Period. It does not enhance the mission to stand around and jackjaw about how much you hate him or how you hope his policies fail. We support the Constitution and our president is Constitutionally elected. <BR/><BR/>Civilians are NOT free to express their opinions about politics if they express support for the success or failure of one party over the other. That is part of the Hatch Act. <BR/><BR/>For crying out loud people, what ever happened to just doing your job? Leave the politics at home. No one can tell what you can and can't say there.A. McCroryhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09465277836269851910noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10820485.post-52738509797453790542009-02-03T12:24:00.000-05:002009-02-03T12:24:00.000-05:00Over the past week there have been several politic...<I>Over the past week there have been several political comments in the local media and I am sure probably around Wright Patterson AFB. Our local news radio station (WHIO) is playing up Rush Limbaugh's comments about our new President and his cabinet. <B>These comments are totally inappropriate and I feel un-American.</B></I><BR/><BR/>Would someone kindly explain to me how it's any of Colonel Franz's official business as to whether the remarks of a private citizen are in any way appropriate or not?Ken Prescotthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13779589712239613030noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10820485.post-6804520412989745362009-02-02T12:25:00.000-05:002009-02-02T12:25:00.000-05:00Jim--Please drop me a line at icspook86@hotmail.co...Jim--Please drop me a line at icspook86@hotmail.com.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12712369389411084085noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10820485.post-56320341169792043222009-02-01T09:27:00.000-05:002009-02-01T09:27:00.000-05:00Nate:You may be too young to have experienced it, ...Nate:<BR/><BR/>You may be too young to have experienced it, but many an exercise scenario during the Carter reign had him being a vacillating dope who couldn't make a decision. Not that it wasn't to the point.TOFhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14234091783167165660noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10820485.post-85484316556640766312009-02-01T02:06:00.000-05:002009-02-01T02:06:00.000-05:00Let's see, the Colonel sends out an email joining ...Let's see, the Colonel sends out an email joining the President in a political attack on a private citizen. The he has the gall in his next breath to warn his underlings about keeping 'discrimination out of our work place'!!!!<BR/><BR/>I am seriously considering filing an IG complaint with the inspector general of the Air Force by this Commander. <BR/><BR/>I understand that sucking up to the boss is an old Air Force tradition, but oral sex is best performed in private.Jim Howardhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18228368552972082442noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10820485.post-20978456875882488082009-01-31T18:46:00.000-05:002009-01-31T18:46:00.000-05:00Maybe the Colonel is one upset Democrat.Maybe the Colonel is one upset Democrat.davodhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09272330967156237637noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10820485.post-17529566781001151232009-01-30T23:23:00.000-05:002009-01-30T23:23:00.000-05:00Col. Franz is an idiot and apparently is the self ...Col. Franz is an idiot and apparently is the self appointed determiner of what is and what isn't un-American. Col. Franz has a right to his opinions - when he is off duty and speaking only for himself and not his command. The dear Colonel has crossed the line. His statement was fine until he injected his personal political view by attacking Mr. Limbaugh and free politcal speech. It is certainly within his purview to remind those under his command of Article 88; however, he went far afield and well beyond his authority.<BR/><BR/>I remember my oath to support and defend the Constitution against all enemies, foreign and domestic. There was nothing in the oath about supporting politicians or blindly following the orders of superiors. "I was just following orders" doesn't cut it anymore as a defense in an Article 32 hearing. Colonel Franz needs a little Indivdual Instruction reminding him that he has a duty to support and defend the Constitution - all of it, including Mr. Limbaugh's 1st Amendment guarantee of free political speech. Is he a Colonel or a comrade?PCSSEPAhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06409465703196815386noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10820485.post-7161319191544865222009-01-30T22:24:00.000-05:002009-01-30T22:24:00.000-05:00(typos corrected, I hope)Well well well. The O-6 s...(typos corrected, I hope)<BR/><BR/>Well well well. The O-6 seems to go over the line a little bit himself here doesn't he?<BR/><BR/>"These comments are totally inappropriate and I feel un-American."<BR/><BR/>And how exactly is that little statement, disparaging the exercise of free speech by an American Citizen, NOT making political speech in the Col's official capacity?<BR/><BR/>The Colonel then ranges in the realm of the insidious:<BR/><BR/>"Our mission is to support and defend the constitution [sic] of the United States. That means supporting our elected officials, as well as the officers appointed over us, and ensuring they succeed."<BR/><BR/>Tying obedience to our oaths to 'supporting our elected officials' and 'ensuring they succeed' extends only so far as it relates to our duty to the Constitution. The Colonel's statement smacks of 'my Commander right or wrong'. Perhaps the Colonel would like to expand upon his understanding of the differences between disparagement of our Civilan authorites and disparagement of their bad policies, especially as it relates to topics unrelated to Defense?<BR/><BR/>I blame the Col's poor rhetoric on poor parenting. The SNCOs he came in contact with as a company-grade Zero should be ashamed.SMSgt Machttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08126690689798203866noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10820485.post-78137003515795020292009-01-30T22:02:00.000-05:002009-01-30T22:02:00.000-05:00This comment has been removed by the author.SMSgt Machttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08126690689798203866noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10820485.post-38699584078250809542009-01-30T21:58:00.000-05:002009-01-30T21:58:00.000-05:00J.R.I would like to Clarify.. I was the one remind...J.R.<BR/><BR/>I would like to Clarify.. I was the one reminding the individuals I was speaking about to their Article 88 responsiblities.. <BR/><BR/>But the people I was speaking of were of higher rank and refused to stop the sly comments. I refered them to the flight commander.. but nothing was ever done. It was very frustrating experience for me.<BR/><BR/>Imagine my surprise when I went into civil service (dept of energy) after my retirement and was regularily hearing negative comments about the President. Of course the no comment policy there was ignored even though it was covered in our ethic training.kitanishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10657260938925328929noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10820485.post-15419504206093452202009-01-30T21:08:00.000-05:002009-01-30T21:08:00.000-05:00A National Guard unit in Illinois was recently sen...A National Guard unit in Illinois was recently sent a similar email from a commander in which subordinates were reminded of the hazards of "inappropriate" and "negative" comments regarding the (now impeached and removed) state governor. It had little effect on stopping the "water cooler talk" but it certainly had a chilling effect on morale. Far from being a reminder of our duties and responsibilities, it reinforced the notion that senior leaders were chosen more for their political affiliation rather than the leadership abilities.Storms24https://www.blogger.com/profile/14360242925876169578noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10820485.post-53881976144967255632009-01-30T16:26:00.000-05:002009-01-30T16:26:00.000-05:00What was Col. Franz thinking when he sent out this...What was Col. Franz thinking when he sent out this e-mail? It reminds me of the Clinton years, when I heard all of this "PC" talk coming from mid-grade officers and CPO's/SNCO's. Having to resort to this shows me a couple of things (1) he's worried about his next fitness report and (2) he doesn't have the leadership skills to talk with his leaders in his unit to remind them of their responsibilities as Airmen and Air Force civilian employees (if this is an actual problem in the unit).<BR/><BR/>Ban move, Col.... you look like an idiot now...fmfnavydochttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10714903349176056488noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10820485.post-24434607137885887412009-01-30T11:46:00.000-05:002009-01-30T11:46:00.000-05:00The only part of that e-mail that's out of lin...The only part of that e-mail that's out of line is the blanket statement about civilians & contractors. Anyone wearing a uniform knows the rules: the President is in your chain, so you salute smartly and shut up unless he's giving you an unlawful order.<BR/><BR/>Civilians and contractors who work with the military should know that their uniformed co-workers are forbidden to express opinions on the subject. The civilians are free to discuss what's going on in Congress, but it's impolite and socially awkward to put your co-workers in that kind of position.<BR/><BR/>Of course, that one line is <I>definitely</I> over the line. I imagine that Wright-Patt legal affairs will send him their recommended revisions, and the new orders will be posted ASAP.<BR/><BR/>Aside to <B>kitanis</B> - it might not have been from my base commander, but I was frequently reminded of my Article 88 responsibilities around elections every year regardless of who was in charge. We were in very civilian-heavy shops, but we all knew that politics was off-limits. The military leans right, so the odds of a soldier popping off in public are higher now that a Democrat is our President -- I'm sure the commander doesn't want to have to fire anyone for a stupid mistake.J.R.https://www.blogger.com/profile/13913599852443572486noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10820485.post-5737215339387121142009-01-30T11:39:00.000-05:002009-01-30T11:39:00.000-05:00This goes above what we went though during the Cli...This goes above what we went though during the Clinton Administration. <BR/><BR/>Article 88 is common broken article.. I noticed that no email messages like this were flying when people were talking about George Bush.. and Yes there were negative comments about our previous president because of the Iraq War. <BR/><BR/>Why worry about what one talk show host is saying about Obama? <BR/><BR/>I too would Love to see this commander apply his new policy to visitors.kitanishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10657260938925328929noreply@blogger.com